AK Worn Effects

[letsgobrowns82]

So I got some of my new AK products in the mail today and I was really excited about the Worn Effects. Anyways its acrylic based and says to spray a couple coats on and then apply an acrylic color over it. Well I dont use acrylics so will enamels still work overtop of this. I hope so. If anyone knows let me know please.

 

[Junkie]

Nope. Need the water based properties of acrylic. You activate the worn effects by adding warm water to your topcoat. Being acrylic...water based...it allows water to penetrate top coat, gets the worn effects loose and therefore you can chip.

At least, as far as I know.

 

[letsgobrowns82]

Well that kinda sucks then. I guess I'm going to have to order a select few acrylic colors when using this then. Thanks for replying.

 

[Junkie]

Yup. Get a few. I'll be worth it. Only way to get that effect. You could salt chip enamel I suppose. Bu for yhe 'hair spray' method...acrylic.

Go fir it.

 

[spud]

lol. time to shift to Acrylics Adam they dry faster and have no stinky smell when u do go to use it add one or 2 drops of water to it as it sprays better

 

[letsgobrowns82]

lol. time to shift to Acrylics Adam they dry faster and have no stinky smell when u do go to use it add one or 2 drops of water to it as it sprays better

Oh man I dont know if I can get off of enamels permanently but it does look like they are going to work their way onto my bench.

 

[TRM]

Hey Aaron...

Enamels do serve a purpose still but it wouldn't be a bad idea to start the shift at some point. There are a number of "sets" that you can get that won't set you back and gives you a good starting point.

Spud has it right, with a couple drops of water the Chipping fluid thins a bit and sprays nicely. I have just turned up the pressure a bit and spay one to two thin coats. You don't need to soak the job to get the effects you need. Simply dampen the work surface in the area you will be working on to chip after you paint and then use a number of tools to aid in the removal of the paint to get the desired chipping effect....Fine paint brushes, stiff bristle stippling brushes, damp cotton swabs or a dampened, soft toothpick to lightly remove the paint from the areas. You will have fun with this stuff!!!

 

[Dusky]

You can always use both. Enamels for the base and acrylic on top of that.

 

[letsgobrowns82]

Well I guess I will slowly start buying acrylics. I dont want to start a war but since I've only ever used enamels what is the consensus out there with acrylics. Tamiya and Vallejo are really the only two I know.

 

[TRM]

There are a ton out there. I will take some liberty and say that Tamiya is top notch for use. There is Vallejo, great stuff but it takes some getting used to with keeping the tip clean and what not. Life Color and Badger a real nice and availability and price...you can't go wrong. Both have "package" sets. Which is a nice way to go. AK has some decent sets. These are color modulation and camo sets but you need not use every color on every build..shading and base, maybe a light one for some highlights is often all that is needed.

You don't need to go crazy...build up the stash of paint as you go!! Grab two or three of the colors you know you use more than others.

There are a few more and I am sure you will get some decent feedback from the HERD on this.

 

[Dusky]

Tamiya, Vallejo, Lifecolor, Humbrol, Revell, Model Master, Gunze, Akan, etc. So many to pick from. The best way to go about it is to buy a couple bottles form several brands and just try them out. You may end up going for more than one for different purposes.

Tamiya and Gunze are nearly fool proof to airbrush, but they are alcohol based acrylics. Neither will brush paint very well an the solvents tend to reactivate the coat below causing it to pull up. Tamiya's color selection leaves a lot to be desired and Gunze no longer dsitrubutes their acrylic line to the US so they are very hard to get a hold of.

Vallejo have two lines fro modelers, the Model Color line and the Model Air line. The Model Color line is thick and most people swear by it for acrylic brush painting. They have a huge color selection, but most of it is not matched, or stated to match, with the typical names we're used to. Some of the Model Color paints use cadium or other heavy metals so you do not want to airbrush those specific colors. The Model Air line is prethinned, airbrush ready paint. Vallejo paints are fragile so you'll need something under them. Vallejo also offers a ton of other products.

Lifecolor is another popular choice by brush and airbrush painters. They make great color matches and offer their own weathering paints and pigments which are also acrylic. I haven't had much like trying to brush paint Lifecolor, but their Tensocrom weathering paints are really easy to use. They have good adhesion as well.

I'd stay away from Model Master. They have poor adhesion, don't always brush well, and some of the color matches are off.

Akan paints are from Russia and thus hard to get a hold of, though Linden Hill does offer some of their colors and may bring in the whole line. They are easy to brush and the color matches are great, especially for Russian stuff. I've had trouble airbrushing them, but others like them.

 

[hooterville75]

Geesh Dusky, thanks man lol. I just bought 40 bottles of Model Masters 1/2 oz bottles off ebay the other week lol. Im going to give em a try as Donn Yost swears by them and gave his technique on how to cut them to airbrush well.

Letsgobrowns, if you want to try the Acrylic paint with your setup your discussing in this post, let me know the colors your looking for and Ill send you a bottle of each to test your setup. I have a ton of Testors 1/4 oz bottles Acrylic. Hate to see you spend the money to find out you dont like them or this method wont work for ya. So let me know the colors and Ill be happy to send you a bottle of Testors of each color to get ya started. If ya like the setup and want to continue then you can buy it and stock your paint stash. If not, no harm no foul. Let me know man.

 

[letsgobrowns82]

Wow thanks for all the feedback guys. I have the AK OIF OEF weathering set and it actually came with a small bottle of US Modern Vehicle tan. I wasnt really planning on weathering the Humvee that I'm doing very heavily but I guess I'm going to try out this effect now. Oh well I guess its going to have to be a worn out Humvee ;D

 

[Elm City Hobbies]

Geesh Dusky, thanks man lol. I just bought 40 bottles of Model Masters 1/2 oz bottles off ebay the other week lol. Im going to give em a try as Donn Yost swears by them and gave his technique on how to cut them to airbrush well.

Letsgobrowns, if you want to try the Acrylic paint with your setup your discussing in this post, let me know the colors your looking for and Ill send you a bottle of each to test your setup. I have a ton of Testors 1/4 oz bottles Acrylic. Hate to see you spend the money to find out you dont like them or this method wont work for ya. So let me know the colors and Ill be happy to send you a bottle of Testors of each color to get ya started. If ya like the setup and want to continue then you can buy it and stock your paint stash. If not, no harm no foul. Let me know man.

I believe Dusky was referring to the Model Master acrylic paints, which basically suck. Their MM enamel line is better, but they are enamel. Fine if you don't mind enamels....I just prefer to use acrylics.

 

[TRM]

LOL...I have the OIF/OEF wash and streaking effects!! Great stuff. You don't have to use it the wear out the vehicle...just add some depth! Good for other stuff too. I just used it as a wash on a Vignette base: http://www.scalemodeladdict.com/index.php/topic,7644.msg119301.html#msg119301 Most if not all the AK line has dozens of uses on things they were not designed for!! LOL!! Getting more bang for you buck!!! ;D

 

[Dusky]

I believe Dusky was referring to the Model Master acrylic paints, which basically suck. Their MM enamel line is better, but they are enamel. Fine if you don't mind enamels....I just prefer to use acrylics.

Eyup. I was referring to the Model Master acrylic line. And for once we agree on something. ;D

 

[Elm City Hobbies]

Vallejo has 4 lines of model paint.

Model Color, approx. 212 colors, more designed for brush painting, can be thinned easy enough (especially with their new thinner), and yes, some colors do have some heavy metals like Cadmium in them, but they are in such small quantities that you would have to swim in a vat of it for a month, and ingest a fair amount for it to be of any harm. Probably more harm done to you being out in the sun for 30mins, however because they do contain these items, they have to put on the bottles the warnings of "Do not spray".

Panzer Aces, 48 colors, same consistency as the Model Color, specialized line for uniform colors, and some special effect colors (rust, wood, rubber, etc,)

Model Air, currently 110 colors, going to be expanded to 125 or so in the new year, pre-thinned for airbrushing, alot of matched RAL, FS, and RLM colors.

Game Color, 90 or so colors, more for the War Gaming market, but they do have some interesting metallic and flesh colors that are only available in that line. Supposed to have an additive to them to make them a little more durable as the figures are handled during the games.

As well you have a line of 16 colored primers, basically paint and primer in one.

I wouldn't really call Vallejo paints "fragile" no more or less fragile than any other acrylic paint. Most acrylics don't possess the catalyst in them to help them "bite" into bare plastic like an enamel or lacquer paint does, which is why they usually require a primer on the kit so the paint has something to bite into.

Once cured, Vallejo paint is one of the toughest out there.

However (and this is borrowing a line from Ken), what makes Vallejo so good at being tough....makes them not so good when used as a color coat over hairspray or the AK Worn Effects, or Heavy Chipping fluids. They are hard to come off, and usually come off in sheets and chunks rather than the more controlled chips.

Tamiya thinned with water instead of alcohol or their own brand thinner is about the best out there for using over a chipping fluid.

That being said, I use Vallejo for about 98% of what I do, and select few other brands for those other jobs that Vallejo isn't as good at.

 

[panzerace007]

LGB ,

Yes .. Liberate yourself Brotha' !! Enamels have Their place, but once you get th feel of Acrylic in th AB You'll Dig it !

AS far as th Chippin' FX goes ..... My experience ...

You ca n shoot th base color in Enamels ... Definitely have to seal it with Dulcote ! Just a couple of light coats !

Th second coat ( the color that will be chipped) ... I would recommend Tamiya. It chips better. Vallejo is more of a "peeling" effect .... Unless that's what you[re goin after ...

You also wanna think of th chipping FX as being used in layers . I did a Whit wash on a Kuble in 3 "layers" . Each layer sealed with Dulcote. The bad thing with sealing with a Gloss is ... The Chippin' FX go on glossy & it's hard to tell how much you are putting down upon a glossy surface.

Each layer - Shot th chipping FX on .. let dry for 15 minutes , shot a thin coat of Tamiya , let dry for 15 minutes . Used Warm distilled water & an assortment of brushes ( some really stiff & even throw a toothpick in th mix - for scratches! ) to chip the paint. after I liked it , I then let it cure/dry over night & sealed th layer with Dulcote.( protecting the surface & FX from th upcoming layer) Between layes you may want to add some streaking with AK's desired streaking FX .

Here are a couple of shots of My Kubel

After the 1st layer of chipping FX on th white wash & some streaks added for flava' !


Third layer , sealed & streaked with Winter Streaking & Nato Rain Marks ( I liked th rain Marks as it made the White Wash look that much more stressed !

​

You don't have to give up & put th enamels away ... but at least for th Chippin' FX you only really need to get some Tamiya (IMHO) & thin it 50/50 with 90% Isopropyl Alcohol ... again ( IMHO) - Oh ... The Streaking FX are all enamel based - so .... food for thought .... 8)

Lookin' forward to th Chips !

\m/

 

[letsgobrowns82]

You guys are awesome. I really dont know what I'd do without this forum.

 

[spud]

You dont need to use distilled water warm tap water will do the job.

As for not spraying some of the Vallejo's wear a mask if you are that weary of them, like Scott said you would need prolonged exposure to it to have any effects on you.

for white wash you cant beat Tamiya White